(FB Archive)
The lath and plaster in our 1884 Victorian is in pretty good shape
That’s good and bad news We need to rewire the house. I still have rooms on knob and tube and previous owners have spliced it and I’m concerned about it. If the plaster was in bad shape I wouldn’t hesitate to punch into it to do the wiring job. But it’s in good enough shape I want to minimize the impact to it.
Does anyone have suggestions on rewiring while minimizing impact on lath and plaster walls and ceilings?
Author: Randy Steinman
All Comments:
Randy Klepinger Behind baseboards and casings, it is typically open. Remove them where needed to run wire. Minimal plaster repair. Balloon construction allows you to go up the exterior walls. This allows you to go around interior walls.
Jodi Click II’ve only opened walls where the outlets, switches, and fixtures will be located. I fish for all the wires with a chain or wire fishing pole (my dad is an electrician). We’ve rewired the whole first floor and half the second so far and no damage to any walls or ceilings at all. You just need patience to do the fishing because it takes longer than punching holes in walls. I also do outlets in floors or sides of built-ins along my masonry walls to not have to hammer-drill into the brick.
Spencer Jacobsen Great comments in here especially ideas for where to run wires! I worked for an old wiring specialist during and after high school. It’s hard work but can be done seamlessly. It’s important to find an electrician that you trust and enjoy having in your home. Finding an electrician that likes old homes is rare, but finding an electrician that knows how to cut plaster is even harder (in delaware, lehigh valley NJ PA) good luck and happy fishing
Dmitri Belser In our 1907 house, we put in all new outlets, but left the K&T for the lights. Since we use LEDs now, the load on the lights is actually less than it has ever been. K&T is not inherently bad, the issue is that the loads we put on outlets now exceed the loads planned back when it was installed.
Dmitri Belser In the duplex we are completing (this month!) we ran the romex behind the baseboards,and put the boxes in the baseboards. Minimal plaster damage. In another house, we pulled off two pieces of lath around the room,ran the romex, put in boxes, and replastered. We have a great plasterer who does glass-smooth plaster finishes.
Deborah McGauley @Dmitri Belser send him to Maine please lol
Deborah McGauley Ugh good luck, I’m just trying to get a picture hook in my plaster..Fail!
Christopher Hewett AdminGroup expert in Old & Historic Homes @Deborah McGauley rhey had picture molding back in the day, attached at each wall stud
Deborah McGauley Allen Straight but arent the ones for heavy kinda big and clunky? I do have some but the sm size is only for .5#..yikes
Deborah McGauley @Christopher Hewett hmm there is crown molding
Deborah McGauley Allen Straight ty, I'll check w my handyman
Christopher Hewett AdminGroup expert in Old & Historic Homes. Over a span is easy as well ...3" gole to access each joist, then 3/4" through the joist for a pass-thru...
Christopher Hewett AdminGroup expert in Old & Historic Homes @Randy Steinman I'll tag you on some previous posts and visuals...all ya need is a few 3" holes - one at top of wall, one at edge of ceiling. Then a 3/4" spade bit through the top plate and/or joist if needed...
Larissa Boiwka Group expert. One of plaster’s virtues is that you can repair it seamlessly. I’d try to minimize the size of the holes just to decrease the amount of work you’ll have to do in repairing, but you won’t be able to tell the difference when all is finished. My plumber had to open up ceilings and walls to repair the radiator pipes, but I fixed the holes and no one can even tell.
Larissa Boiwka Group expert. Same spot
Doug Miller Moderator. I have some rooms that are still Knob and Tube. I've switched all the lights in those rooms to led's. The truth is, if the wiring isn't being disturbed and it's only carrying a small electric load, it can last a very long time without being a hazard.
Bambi Harris I used the old wiring to fish the new wires. The upstairs floorboards had been skillfully cut to wire the lights below. It took a while to see the cuts.
Douglas Laws I was able to cut the floorboards to wire my 1905 &1895 homes and put outlets in the tall baseboards
Barton Scott Get a reputable electrician and yes they can fish new wire and remove or leave old not live anymore.
Elias Orloff Hire an electrician who is experienced in fishing wires with minimal wall damage. Also any electrician who knows how to do this should have worked in enough older homes to know to cut small regular shaped holes where needed (if at all) to make repairs easier and cheaper. With my plaster and drywall repair company we follow a lot of these jobs and some electricians are butchers, others artists in regards to the holes they cut. Either way we make it disappear but if your doing the wall repair yourself it will save you countless hours of the holes are small and uniform.
Christopher Hewett AdminGroup expert in Old & Historic Homes @Elias Orloff yep, many electricians want to "trench" plaster walls...I got rid of that guy, and did a out 1/3 myself.
Terry Norris Buckey Our house was built in 1903 and they had done the same thing. One year we had a really bad ice storm that knocked out the power in three counties for like 7 days. When the power crews came to help to turn the power back on they accidentally used our house as a ground for 3-phase electric that the people had next door and burned all the wiring up through the walls in our house. Nationwide paid $25,000 to have our house totally rewired plus they had to pay for anything and everything that was plugged in plus all the ceiling fans. Our electrician pulled wires through the walls from the attic down through each plug in the floor and each switch plate. They never had to put hole one in that plaster. Our electrician told us that it was actually a good thing that that happened because the house probably would have ended up burning down because of the wiring. Three years later my son accidentally caught the house on fire, and we ended up having to gut the house to save it.
Shane Walp DANG!
Elizabeth Melville @Terry Norris Buckey - I think I would have to move. Lol
Ryan Johnson Group expert. What I did was pull the baseboards and fished the wires that way. Minimal plaster damage
Lisa Ellison Smith We put in new breaker boxes and ran all new wire. My husband removed the old boxes (electricity was off completely) and he tied on new wire to the old and pulled it through until he reached the receptical. Curse words were said as he had to gingerly work the new wire through. He did have to open the plaster in a few spots, but mostly all was done this way.
Jodi Click @Lisa Ellison Smith Curse words are mandatory for that work.
Valorie Sherman My contractor opened the walls enough to fish the wires through. He plaster patched the holes and you really can’t tell because the plaster is textured. Otherwise he was able to fish new wire by attaching it to the old and pulling it back through.
Tricia Brank This article discusses insulation holding moisture inside the walls to the point that the clapboards won’t hold paint.http://bobyapp.com/.../myths-about-insulating-old-house...
Max Howard O pull the baseboards to run the wire around the room. We had a small gap in the floor we put all the wiring in
Max Howard Hole up top, hole down below minimal repair.
G Wayne Wilcox Ok here is my public worth and electric manifesto. Remove all that old crap from your fuseboxes. It became illegal to patch into knob and tube wiring in 1985. The situation like that almost killed me. I was replacing ceiling tiles when I touch an air conditioning duct electricity went through my fingers to my forearm through the wire metal of the ceiling tiles through my other arm into a ground and burnt me. Luckily the electricity did not pass through my heart. To pass your house on to Future generations install shielded cable and conduit.Rodents eat Romex!I also advocate installing sprinklers and they make PEX fitting sprinklers now.Make friends!
Roxanne Elise Abler @G Wayne Wilcox if I'm correct, it's still legal to splice as long as it's inside a junction box. My house definitely has Romex spliced into K&T in places. I'm crossing my fingers that they did it properly inside of a box but I don't know. I pulled up some attic floorboards one morning and saw Romex running along through that damn cellulose insulation, but I know that the light fixtures, outlets, and switches in the bedrooms below have k&t running into them. It's a spring project for sure... We actually plan to have the entire second story re-wired and put on multiple circuits instead of being on one like it is currently. We just have to have the money for it. The Romex looked very new and under one floorboard I could see the k&t wires cut and going to nothing, which was a real head-scratcher. I'm not going to go digging through the cellulose for fear of electrocution unless I use a non-conductive tool like a wooden paint stick.
G Wayne Wilcox Spend a weekend with the NEC.Get rid of that cellulose ASAP!It is fireproofed with Bismuth..a sin of the past like nob and Tube.
G Wayne Wilcox I would never fish Romex over unseen nails and screws. Shielded cable insures safety in installation and protection from rodents.Make Friends!
Alison Harrington Larsson Is the house Insulated??Our house was built in 1845 we could see from the attic into the basement running all new electric was surprisingly simple
Randy Steinman Author @Alison Harrington Larsson it is not insulated that’s also a factor in wiring. I want insulation. I hear it’s a good thing
Alison Harrington Larsson @Randy Steinman ok, NOW you need to do the wiring. Before insulting.Depending on what state you live on the MIGHT have a program to help you with insulation costs.We live In Massachusetts, and only paid a FRACTION of the cost. State grant paid for the rest.They might have a program to help you update wiring also.
Glenn McCusker Do you have a basement and an attic? Balloon framing?
Randy Steinman Author @Glenn McCusker yes
Glenn McCusker A good restoration electrician should be able to fish wires without too much destruction.
Jodi Click Yep, this. If you have a basement and attic, you shouldn’t need to damage a single wall or ceiling! My only damage has been where I had to cut into the second story floors over existing first-floor ceiling fixtures to remove the old wiring and run new since there was no other way to access that old wiring.